Civic-EG.com Forum 3.3.1

- Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:53 pm #87652 Any recommendations for a stiff ride?

93 si

I'm pretty sure it's at stock height

Riding 205/55/R16 all round, but when I hit a bump my fuckin rear tire wells bout cuts the rubber off my wheel.

I have 205/45/16's for the front (havent put em on yet). Would I be good just getting a slimmer tire, like a 195? Or is there anything else I can do to counteract that?

I don't have tons of money to spend so a cost-effective plan is ideal.

- Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:25 pm #87654 skunk2 coil + shocks = tits!

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- Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:44 am #87749 how much of a budget are you on? give us a rough figure of how much your willing to spend at a maximum and we can through you some options

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:59 am #87753

how much of a budget are you on? give us a rough figure of how much your willing to spend at a maximum and we can through you some options

I think I'm just getting stiffer springs and rolling my fenders.

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:57 am #87762 First off your tire size it all wrong. For 16s on a civic you need 205/40R16s.

And for buget suspension, depends on what you want it for and how much you want to spend.

1986 Nissan 300zx
1980 Kawasaki KZ650
2014 Kawasaki Ninja 300

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:39 am #87775

I think I'm just getting stiffer springs and rolling my fenders.

You won't be getting a stiff ride with any srpings.
You will need coilovers for a stiff ride.

Skunk2 coilovers+tokico alluminis=stiff ride on a budget.

Its not gonna be all super stiff but on a budget its the stiffest you gonna get.

BoRIcuA y QUE!

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:47 am #87784 energy suspension bushings. Never heard of anyone not liking them, although it is a lot of work putting them in. Ounce for ounce probably the biggest change in ride quality.

like the others asked. Price range?

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:25 am #87792

I think I'm just getting stiffer springs and rolling my fenders.

You won't be getting a stiff ride with any srpings.
You will need coilovers for a stiff ride.

Skunk2 coilovers+tokico alluminis=stiff ride on a budget.

Its not gonna be all super stiff but on a budget its the stiffest you gonna get.

lol I beg to differ my mates toyota paseo is on cobra springs and the ride is bone crushingly hard

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:38 pm #87809

lol I beg to differ my mates toyota paseo is on cobra springs and the ride is bone crushingly hard

Never heard of springs being stiffer than coilovers.
But its probably what kind of shocks yours friend is using also.

Cus for sure srpings on stock shocks are not gonna be stiff at all. Most of the stiffness and support comes from the shocks.

BoRIcuA y QUE!

- Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:47 pm #87814 Not true, stiffness is spring related.

However in a lot of cases standard shocks are way overdamped for stiffer springs leading to a harder ride. If the spring is fully compressed and then released with over damped shocks it just returns to its neutral state instantly which is what makes it feel much stiffer than it is.

You'll find that coilovers use much stiffer springs and are damped to accomodate but a lower spring will be very soft by comparison, but if the standard shocks have been 'fine tuned' for the standard springs in such a way that the ride feels a little firm but not uncomfortable then an uprated spring will ruin ride comfort completely as happened with my mates car.

- Sat Jan 10, 2009 2:52 am #87950

Not true, stiffness is spring related.

However in a lot of cases standard shocks are way overdamped for stiffer springs leading to a harder ride. If the spring is fully compressed and then released with over damped shocks it just returns to its neutral state instantly which is what makes it feel much stiffer than it is.

You'll find that coilovers use much stiffer springs and are damped to accomodate but a lower spring will be very soft by comparison, but if the standard shocks have been 'fine tuned' for the standard springs in such a way that the ride feels a little firm but not uncomfortable then an uprated spring will ruin ride comfort completely as happened with my mates car.

This is true

It's all in the springs. I tested my omni shocks with the omni springs and then my friends koni springs, MASSIVE difference in stiffness between the two, the omni's are way stiffer than my friends koni's, and these aren't even the stiffest setup you can have

StuRat - The cheapest way of getting a good set of springs dampers or even coilovers is ebay. There are loads of bargains to be had. Another friend of mine recently got a set of D2's for his eg6 at £250 which had covered 2k miles. Looked like new too, so have a look at that if you really want a good set of suspension for a good price, but please post a budget so we can give you the best setup for the money you want to spend.

Also remember if you lower your car on just springs and go too low, you will be shortening the life of your shocks and hopefully you wont be cutting springs as it's rice and not worth it.

- Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:32 am #87959

Not true, stiffness is spring related.

However in a lot of cases standard shocks are way overdamped for stiffer springs leading to a harder ride. If the spring is fully compressed and then released with over damped shocks it just returns to its neutral state instantly which is what makes it feel much stiffer than it is.

You'll find that coilovers use much stiffer springs and are damped to accomodate but a lower spring will be very soft by comparison, but if the standard shocks have been 'fine tuned' for the standard springs in such a way that the ride feels a little firm but not uncomfortable then an uprated spring will ruin ride comfort completely as happened with my mates car.

Its a combination of both. Shock and spring.
For example: you're not telling me that if we both get lets say sum tein srpings but I slap them on tokico alluminis which are 5 way adjustable dampning and you on stock or none adjustable dampning shocks. They are both gonna be the same as stiff?? Not a chance. And coilovers are always gonna have a higher spring rate. Specially when compressed.

BoRIcuA y QUE!

- Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:33 am #88024

Its a combination of both. Shock and spring.
For example: you're not telling me that if we both get lets say sum tein srpings but I slap them on tokico alluminis which are 5 way adjustable dampning and you on stock or none adjustable dampning shocks. They are both gonna be the same as stiff?? Not a chance. And coilovers are always gonna have a higher spring rate. Specially when compressed.

Shocks don't define stiffness. Springs do. Damping is what makes a setup feel stiffer than it is. It's quite simple in practice.

Say this is a traditional coil / damper arrangement on a stock car, designed to provide a smooth ride:



Note that you get some return in the suspension while the damper does its work.

Now, consider the same spring with a more extreme damper:



Initial bump is exactly the same BUT, because the damping ratio is much higher there is less rebound on the return on the spring to its natural position.

A higher damping ratio simply changes how the spring reacts after the initial reaction, it has no effect on stiffness. However, a higher damping ratio will make the ride feel stiffer, but only because there is a smaller rebound as the spring settles.

In reality though the damping response curve is exponential but for ease of explanation I defined it as a linear response

Spring = stiffness
Damping = response to spring motion

Not the best diagrams but I'm still half asleep...

And also, spring rate doesn't change when the spring is compressed unless it's progressive, which it never is with a coilover as the whole point of it is to provide completely linear response.

If there is one thing I know about on cars it's how the suspension does its job

- Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:24 pm #88119 Bump..

Im also redoing my entire suspension and doing the numbers right now to see what would be cheapest but most effective...im looking to spend around 300-400 on shocks alone..leaning toward the Tokico HP series or Illuminas keeping in mind these range from 80-110 a pop...BUT already on my ride are a set of coil overs (no name brand) ...id like to retain the coil-overs but any suggestions on a complete make over w/o spending more than 400? When i put the coil-overs on we had to cut the dust covers so not positive if these were car specific etc. So yeah ...any help would be appreciated gents

Edit: So I checked into some of the suggestions ya'll made prior to me askin and came up with Skunk 2 Coilovers w/ Tokico HP Series shocks..Im working on a tight budget and this is gonna come out to about $600, little more than i wanted to spend but w/ lifetime warranty not a bad deal

We find three kittens and a squirrel cowering in fear inside one of the massive front air intakes.

[suspendedHatch]

- Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:07 pm #88128

You won't be getting a stiff ride with any srpings.
You will need coilovers for a stiff ride.

What are you talking about? Where do you get your info?

The difference between a spring and a coilover has NOTHING to do with suspension stiffness. It has to do with height adjustability.

Coilovers are made up of springs and a strut that has an adjustable lower spring perch. Changing the positions of the perches on the strut body affects the ride height.

An aftermarket spring kit just provides shorter, stiffer springs that mount like stock. Either to your stock struts, or aftermarket replacement struts. Height is not adjustable.

The stiffness of the spring is decided by the spring manufacturer. There is nothing to stop them from using softer than stock rates on a coilover suspension, or virtually inflexible springs in their spring kit. And if you order a Ground Control coilover suspension kit, you could swap out the included springs for some custom rate Eibach springs for any stiffness you want.

To the OP, stiffness is an unfortunate byproduct of suspension tuning. It's not desirable. The stiffer the spring, the LESS traction you have. The trade-off is reduced body roll. In your case the problem is that your wheel/tire aspect ratio is too big. There is really not much you can do but get the correct size wheels and tires. If you increase the spring rate to the point that your wheels don't bottom out, your car will be too dangerous to drive on the street. You'll slide right off the pavement in a turn.