What do you think of this build.

N/A build discussion
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What do you think of this build.

By poorman type-r
- Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:54 pm #213892 A buddy of mine wanted me to write out an all motor build. Let me know what you think of it.

-B20b sleeved-85mm Bore, Hone, Decked, Micropolish and Balance Crank
-Carrol Rods
-CP 15:1 custom pistons w/ rings
-ACL Bearings
-OEM 3 Layer 85mm Head Gasket
-Portflow port & polish, Super Tech Stainless Steel nitride coated valves, dual valve springs, titanium retainers, competition 3 angle valve job
-ARP head studs and rod bolts
-Mishimoto Full Length Radiator w/ Slim Fan
-TWM Individual Throttle Bodies-52mm
-Apexi Racing Spark Plugs
-MSD Ignition Custom Spark Plug Wire Set- 8.5mm
-Crane Multi-Spark Ignition Kit
-MSD Distributor cap & Rotor
-High End Tri-Y Headers
-P28 ECU w/ Hondata S200
-Walbro 255 LPH Fuel Pump
-Lenzo Drag Slicks
-Level 2.9 axels
-Skunk 2 Pro-Series Ground Control Coilovers
-Hasport Motor Mounts
-Type-R Tranny
-ACT Stage 3 Clutch kit
-Findaza Flywheel- 8lbs.
-Greddy Timing Belt
-CTR Crank Pulley
-Crower Stage 4 cams
-NRG Tech Traction Control Bars
-Skunk 2 Short throw shifter


Alright well that's what I got so far. Please by all means add onto it if there is anything im missing (which im sure there is a lot) or if I should get a different company part over one I have listed. Thanks.
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Re: What do you think of this build.

By That One Dude
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:16 pm #214005
poorman type-r wrote:A buddy of mine wanted me to write out an all motor build. Let me know what you think of it.

-B20b sleeved-85mm Bore, Hone, Decked, Micropolish and Balance Crank
-Carrol Rods
-CP 15:1 custom pistons w/ rings
-ACL Bearings
-OEM 3 Layer 85mm Head Gasket
-Portflow port & polish, Super Tech Stainless Steel nitride coated valves, dual valve springs, titanium retainers, competition 3 angle valve job
-ARP head studs and rod bolts
-Mishimoto Full Length Radiator w/ Slim Fan
-TWM Individual Throttle Bodies-52mm
-Apexi Racing Spark Plugs
-MSD Ignition Custom Spark Plug Wire Set- 8.5mm
-Crane Multi-Spark Ignition Kit
-MSD Distributor cap & Rotor
-High End Tri-Y Headers
-P28 ECU w/ Hondata S200
-Walbro 255 LPH Fuel Pump
-Lenzo Drag Slicks
-Level 2.9 axels
-Skunk 2 Pro-Series Ground Control Coilovers
-Hasport Motor Mounts
-Type-R Tranny
-ACT Stage 3 Clutch kit
-Findaza Flywheel- 8lbs.
-Greddy Timing Belt
-CTR Crank Pulley
-Crower Stage 4 cams
-NRG Tech Traction Control Bars
-Skunk 2 Short throw shifter


Alright well that's what I got so far. Please by all means add onto it if there is anything im missing (which im sure there is a lot) or if I should get a different company part over one I have listed. Thanks.


Don't use the CTR pulley. Get a stock pulley and have a machine shop cut it down and balance it. The main bearings and oil pump will thank you.

ENDYN makes a main girdle for the LS/B20 blocks. Get that and a GSR oil pan/oil pickup tube. Have the oil pan baffled to prevent oil starvation in high G corners.

Use the stock ignition system. It's good for way more power than this build should put down. Also, NGK wires are way cheaper than MSD wires.

I didn't know Crower makes stage 4 cams for the non-VTEC head...

The TWM ITBs are a great thing. But you can't guess on the stack sizes. Those are critical for inlet air velocity, density, and pulsing.
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Re: What do you think of this build.

By Greasedmonkey
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:42 pm #214009
poorman type-r wrote:A buddy of mine wanted me to write out an all motor build. Let me know what you think of it.

-B20b sleeved-85mm Bore, Hone, Decked, Micropolish and Balance Crank
-Carrol Rods
-CP 15:1 custom pistons w/ rings What fuel do you plan on running with this?
-ACL Bearings
-OEM 3 Layer 85mm Head Gasket
-Portflow port & polish, Super Tech Stainless Steel nitride coated valves, dual valve springs, titanium retainers, competition 3 angle valve job VTEC head?
-ARP head studs and rod bolts
-Mishimoto Full Length Radiator w/ Slim Fan
-TWM Individual Throttle Bodies-52mm Dont guess this number
-Apexi Racing Spark Plugs NGKs work just fine.
-MSD Ignition Custom Spark Plug Wire Set- 8.5mm Pointless
-Crane Multi-Spark Ignition Kit Not needed
-MSD Distributor cap & Rotor Useless...but get the clear one its cool.
-High End Tri-Y Headers
-P28 ECU w/ Hondata S200 Dont cheap out on us now...S300
-Walbro 255 LPH Fuel Pump
-Lenzo Drag Slicks Lenzo makes rims... Didnt know they made tires.
-Level 2.9 axels
-Skunk 2 Pro-Series Ground Control Coilovers There are WAY WAY better out there[/b]
-Hasport Motor Mounts
-Type-R Tranny
-ACT Stage 3 Clutch kit
-Findaza Flywheel- 8lbs.
-Greddy Timing Belt
-CTR Crank Pulley
-Crower Stage 4 cams
-NRG Tech Traction Control Bars
-Skunk 2 Short throw shifter


Alright well that's what I got so far. Please by all means add onto it if there is anything im missing (which im sure there is a lot) or if I should get a different company part over one I have listed. Thanks.



Other than the BOLD items I likes it. If crower makes cames like that. I hope its a VTEC head motor.
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By jrhdominos
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:26 pm #214016 1. I agree with "That One Dude" about the ctr crank pulley. I have a bit more info on it so Ill do my best to explain... The pulley obviously comes off a b16b from the Civic Type R, which for the most part is a track ready civic. These motors, which like I said are primarily used on the track, are torn down and rebuilt so much that the performance gained from using the pulley is probably worth it, but for a daily driven civic, the stock pulley machined and balanced would save your oil pump, and keep you from spinning bearings.
2. The cp 15:1 custom pistons are imo overkill. I would go with teg type R pistons or aftermarket pistons with 12:1/13:1 compression, and the 13:1 might be pushing it for pump gas.
3. We are all assuming based on your build up for your head, that your using a VTEC head. I would go with a built b16 head or a built type r head, with the type R manifold, as ITBs are nice but for a b20/vtec build I think a built head with stock mani would work just fine.
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By poorman type-r
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:54 pm #214020 This build is going to be for track only, running race gas. It might see the street every once in a while. So is 15:1 still too much?
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By That One Dude
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:30 pm #214028 I don't see why 15:1 would be a problem. Bisimoto is running roughly 16:1 in his record-breaking NA F series. Especially since you're planning on running race gas only.

Still need to know if you're using a VTEC or non-VTEC head.
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By poorman type-r
- Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:15 pm #214044 Oh its going to be a b16a head. Also what octane should I run? 110? Or higher? Should I run a higher compression piston? Is 16:1 the highest you can go?
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By That One Dude
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 12:56 am #214067 That changes EVERYTHING. But not really.

As far as octane ratings, you ought to talk directly to the tuner about goals, timing, fuel, and fuel delivery because he is going to be the one to actually make the power happen ultimately. He will also be more able to tell you what fuel you will need better than I can...

I imagine you could get a higher compression piston set, but you have to worry about piston to head clearance, piston to valve clearance, valve to valve clearance, and piston to spark plug clearance more so with the extreme compression you're looking for.
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By poorman type-r
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 1:02 am #214070 Dang that's a lot of things to look out for. What is the highest you have seen in a B series.?
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By jrhdominos
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 1:41 am #214083 if its a track car that will see regular rebuilds and race gas, then by all means build up and haul ass....but cars that are built like this, from my experience, it just seems like they require CONSTANT maintenence..just make sure that motor is built and tuned properly...running that high of compression requires a very meticulous rebuild. Bisi IS one of the best at what he does..and for that reason he can build 16:1 compression motors...I just feel like for reliabilty's sake that a 12:1 or 13:1 would be sufficient...but every man to himself..Im excited about this build and I actually hope this works out for your buddy :)
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By That One Dude
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:51 am #214106 I agree 100%. It's not going to be the most reliable thing ever. Period.

I was simply stating that it's possible to have this build with those specs.

Sure as shit it won't be easy. And it will be extremely expensive.

And you had better know EXACTLY what you're doing with manuals, documentation, procedures, the whole nine hundred yards.

The reason Bisi and the like CAN do these kind of builds is because of their experience, and their sourcing connections. Bisi can call someone and have a part same day or next day, I imagine. And if he can't GET the part, he will MAKE the part.

I've seen roughly 280whp from an NA ITR. The guy spun three rod bearings at 10k RPM one day out ripping on the street. Somehow he got a chunk of carbon lodged in the oil pump. He's lucky the whole head and mains were salvageable. Since then, he rebuilt the engine, and ispumping out a reliable 250whp NA on a fully stock engine spare for 13:1 pistons and 100 octane Aviation Gasoline.

I want to see this build manifested.
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By Greasedmonkey
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 4:37 am #214123 I have seen 12.5 and 13:1 CR be used and still only need 93 octane. Its all in the tuning.

A guy I ran with for a while had an ENDYNE built b20/vtec make just over 240whp on 12.5:1 with 93 octane. Still driven on the street but for hte most part a track car. Car was a beast on the track.


You do not need 14+ CR to make power for a track car.
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By poorman type-r
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:07 am #214136 So are you telling me 16:1 will be a waste in power? If you built a 13:1 motor against a 16:1 with the same internals there wont be much of a difference?
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By 93hatcheg
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 7:14 pm #214182 pretty much yea. a 16:1 CR is redicoulous. that kinda compression is for mosterous power for short time. kinda like a top fuel dragster insane power for 3sec and then the motor gets rebuilt. plus 16:1 compression is going to yeild wayy more depth than just putting together a motor, withought going insanely above and beyond and using the best tools to get exact measurments its wont last more than a couple minuts. plus this build is going to cost sooo much its not even funny, lets just say this will in no way be cheap
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By Greasedmonkey
- Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:40 pm #214191 I would say anything above 13:1 will involve more work than its worth to put the motor together. The higher the CR the more attention it will need. Do you really want a motor you have to rebuild after one or two runs? Or would you like to have a more reliable build that will take a year or so of runs?
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