Civic EG

When I got my car, I noticed the guy had tossed a fuel pump in the back seat. When I asked about it, he said, "It's a civic problem, they need to be replaced" so I added it to my ToDo list when I had time.

I've had the car since April, and most times it takes two cranks to start it (starts on the 2nd crank). Oddly enough, in the Haynes it mentions that factory pumps are bad and will cause the car to not start on the first crank.

Trouble is, the pump he gave me has some dirt on the top (near the fuel lines, can post some pics if that would help), but the guy said it's easy to install so I assume the one in the backseat wasn't my old one.

Here is what I'm now curious about - the pump itself, the wires and the sock are all clean (but sock smells vaguely of fuel), so could it be that a new pump was installed on an old pump's framework? Is the Haynes right in saying that the 2-crank problem can be solved by replacing the fuel pump, and if so, would testing it (the "new" one) with a voltmeter reveal if it has the same problem as a factory pump? Or should I just buy a new one so I know its condition?

I just don't want my starter to keep doing double duty, ya know?

Thanks everyone

To me, if you have extra money, get a new one. That way you have the piece of mind knowing that it's a brand new fuel pump.

marquisdee1018 wrote:To me, if you have extra money, get a new one. That way you have the piece of mind knowing that it's a brand new fuel pump.

x2. that way you wont be doing the guess work.

Thanks guys, appreciate the input.

As for finding a replacement pump, any suggestions? I took a look on eBay and found supposedly new pumps anywhere from $17 to $180. I doubt I need something name brand, but I also doubt that $17 will get me a quality product.

I wouldn't think it would be over $100. I bought a new 255 LPH Walbro for $90, so a stock rated one should be less than that.

Yeah I saw (I assume that one) on eBay for $90.

Would you trust something such as this: http://tinyurl.com/lo7m8v or this: http://tinyurl.com/maagup?

the second one looks more like the pumps I've seen before

I've never had a Honda or Acura fuel pump go out on me in the 7 years that I've been daily driving them. I've also never heard of them going out. But I have heard that if you drive on low gas all the time you can burn them up. You can get a used one from a 94+ Integra. I would never waste my money buying one brand new. I've never had a problem with used parts especially when you can find an Integra as new as 01 and be able to use it's parts.

Honda problems almost always relate to the ignition system. Honda integrated the ICM and a small coil inside the distributor housing. Coils run hot and produce a very high voltage. If you let the plugs go too long you burn the coil and ICM up. This leads to intermittent problems but not always at starting.

The other major problem with Hondas 93 and older are the main relays. Around 94 they switched to a different supplies so it's a good idea to find a 94 or later Civic or Integra and grab the main relay. This can cause an intermittent problem like you're describing.

But don't just throw parts at it based on guesses over the internet. There are troubleshooting flow charts in the repair manual to determine if a particular part is bad or not.

Teal, Suspended, appreciate the input guys, it's nice hearing from knowledgeable gurus such as yourselves.

I never drive around on low gas in any car I've driven, and I've never seen a fuel light come on (which means they've been broken or I haven't driven them far enough :-D).

But Suspended, you would sooner suspect the main relay or coil pack for the multiple cranks than a fuel pump? And I haven't thrown parts at it yet, thankfully - I have the pump from the guy I bought from and it hasn't been at the top of my todo list, but if I can save my car from doing extra work I'll see what I can do.

As for the flow charts, are you referring to the factory service manuals available here: http://civic-eg.com/viewtopic.php?t=1217? I downloaded one a few weeks back but haven't cracked it open yet (figuratively speaking).

if it is not starting on the warmest/hot days, that's a good sign it is the main relay.

But it sounds like that is not your problem. What exactly happens when it does not start on the first crank? a single click, a constant clicking, does it turn over like it wants to start, sputter at all?

Temperature doesn't seem to play a huge role in it. Some days it can sit in sun for 6 hours while I'm at work and it starts on first crank, or it can be 9am and sitting in the shade. If I had to put a percentage on it, I would say 80% of starts take the second crank (but never more than 2).

The first crank sounds strong, it just doesn't kick the engine over. I let it rest until I hear everything quiet down, then give it a turn and it's pretty much instantaneous. If my memory serves me, I tried experimenting with one longer crank (2-3 seconds) a few weeks ago and it turned it on the first, but I'm not comfortable with that long of a crank every time I start it.

if the starter isn't turning the engine over, I would look in that area rather than fuel pump or main relay.

Check all your connections & grounds to the starter. How many miles does your engine have? starters have contacts that eventually wear out & need replaced. When this happens, tapping the starter with a hammer will usually be a temporary fix.

Unfortunately I don't know with 100% certainty how many miles my engine has - I have 160k on the body and was told ~80k on the engine.

As for the tapping with a hammer, what sort of tapping are we talking? Enough to make a noise, enough to make a dent :-)?

I'd say somewhere between noise & dent

My main relay problem had no correlation with temperature. It's a cheap and easy fix, worth giving a shot before you spend too much time on it. One plug and a 10mm bolt in easy reach.